Tute y Liniers: todo lo que puede tener adentro un lápiz

{"id":669,"id_simpleblog_post":"669","id_simpleblog_category":"37","id_simpleblog_post_type":"1","id_simpleblog_author":"0","author":"Sebasti\u00e1n De Caro","author_url":"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/1972-sebastian-de-caro","likes":"0","views":"6899","allow_comments":"3","is_featured":"1","access":"a:3:{i:1;b:1;i:2;b:1;i:3;b:1;}","cover":"jpg","featured":"jpg","id_product":"","id_category_tematica":"","id_category_autor":"","id_category_editorial":"","id_event":"0","active":"1","title":"Tute y Liniers: todo lo que puede tener adentro un l\u00e1piz","meta_title":"Tute y Liniers: todo lo que puede tener adentro un l\u00e1piz","meta_description":"Reproducimos en exclusiva en LENGUA el di\u00e1logo que mantuvieron Tute y Liniers, dos de los dibujantes argentinos m\u00e1s reconocidos y con m\u00e1s proyecci\u00f3n internacional, en la \u00faltima edici\u00f3n de la Feria del Libro de Buenos Aires.","meta_keywords":"Revista Lengua Tute Liniers historieta vi\u00f1eta comic Macanudo Clemente","short_content":"<p>Son dos de los dibujantes argentinos m\u00e1s le\u00eddos\u00a0y\u00a0reconocidos\u00a0en el mundo. Sus obras despliegan universos personales inconfundibles pero est\u00e1n unidas de forma invisible por el mismo hilo emocional: ambas retratan espacios de la vida interior, \u00edntimos, familiares, reconocibles. Tute lo hace con una mirada m\u00e1s cercana al psicoan\u00e1lisis; Liniers, desde la imaginaci\u00f3n sin l\u00edmites de la infancia. Reproducimos en exclusiva el di\u00e1logo que mantuvieron con el escritor y director de cine Sebasti\u00e1n De Caro en la \u00faltima edici\u00f3n de la Feria del Libro de Buenos Aires, la primera despu\u00e9s de dos a\u00f1os de pandemia, en el que intercambiaron recuerdos de sus inicios, hablaron de herencias e influencias, homenajearon a esa figura tutelar que es Quino y recorrieron las diferentes formas en que los componentes autobiogr\u00e1ficos y la educaci\u00f3n sentimental se cuelan en una vida \u2014o dos\u2014 en vi\u00f1etas.<\/p>","full_content":"","content":"[{\"id\":\"59us007\",\"elType\":\"section\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_layout\":\"\",\"stretch_section\":\"\",\"layout\":\"boxed\",\"content_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"gap\":\"default\",\"height\":\"default\",\"custom_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":400},\"column_position\":\"middle\",\"content_position\":\"\",\"structure\":\"10\",\"section_background\":\"\",\"background_background\":\"\",\"background_color\":\"\",\"background_color_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":0},\"background_color_b\":\"\",\"background_color_b_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":100},\"background_gradient_type\":\"linear\",\"background_gradient_angle\":{\"unit\":\"deg\",\"size\":180},\"background_gradient_position\":\"center 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Cr\u00e9dito: Liniers y 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De Caro:<\/strong> El se\u00f1or Liniers tuvo el gesto de traerle de regalo al se\u00f1or Tute una vi\u00f1eta, el original de una historieta que fue publicada en el diario <em>La Naci\u00f3n<\/em>, donde vemos a los ping\u00fcinos con Clemente, recordando a Caloi, y antes de que empez\u00e1ramos esta charla se produjo otra conversaci\u00f3n muy interesante. Me sent\u00ed un privilegiado porque hablaban sobre dibujar a Clemente y uno piensa, a priori, que para Tute hacer a Clemente debe ser una cosa de toda vida. Pero est\u00e1n los problemas t\u00e9cnicos, de hecho, habl\u00e1bamos de que este es un Clemente que est\u00e1 mirando hacia la derecha cuando no s\u00e9 por qu\u00e9 casi todos los Clementes miran hacia la izquierda. No s\u00e9 si alguna vez se lo vio de frente.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> En general, siempre era hacia la izquierda. Yo tambi\u00e9n lo dibujo hacia la izquierda.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Yo lo dibujaba de chico. Cuando empec\u00e9 a dibujar copiaba a los personajitos (de las tiras). Clemente deton\u00f3 en Argentina en el mundial '82 cuando apareci\u00f3 en la televisi\u00f3n. Exist\u00edan los Muppets y de repente exist\u00eda un muppet argentino; estaban las hinchadas, hab\u00edamos ganado el mundial anterior. Primero lo conoc\u00ed en versi\u00f3n muppet, con la voz de Pelusa Suero, diciendo \u00abEh, muchachos, tiren papelitos\u00bb, y despu\u00e9s lo fui encontrando en dibujito, pero al principio yo trataba de dibujar el muppet, que era m\u00e1s dif\u00edcil, por la tridimensionalidad.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Tiene una est\u00e9tica muppet este que hizo Liniers. Lo m\u00e1s lindo es ver Clementes mal dibujados, con la impronta del dibujante, incluso dibujando lo hacen como Liniers, de memoria. Es m\u00e1s interesante porque el Clemente \u00abmarca Caloi\u00bb ya lo conocemos todos, ya lo vimos todos, en cambio cuando tiene algo del dibujante, el que lo hace dibuja a Clemente pero deja algo de su propio estilo. A m\u00ed me gusta m\u00e1s, es m\u00e1s lindo.\u00a0Yo tengo un Clemente que hice con un a\u00f1o y medio, que son dos puntos, una raya y varias rayas horizontales. Es muy 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style=\\\"text-align: right;\\\">Clemente por Liniers, publicado en el diario <em>La Naci\u00f3n<\/em>. Cr\u00e9dito: Liniers.<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"\",\"typography_typography\":\"\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"10\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"10\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}}],\"editSettings\":{}}],\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"chtgcr3\",\"elType\":\"section\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_layout\":\"\",\"stretch_section\":\"\",\"layout\":\"boxed\",\"content_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"gap\":\"default\",\"height\":\"default\",\"custom_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":400},\"column_position\":\"middle\",\"content_position\":\"\",\"structure\":\"10\",\"section_background\":\"\",\"background_background\":\"\",\"background_color\":\"\",\"background_color_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":0},\"background_color_b\":\"\",\"background_color_b_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":100},\"background_gradient_type\":\"linear\",\"background_gradient_angle\":{\"unit\":\"deg\",\"size\":180},\"background_gradient_position\":\"center 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Todos los ni\u00f1os son artistas y en tu caso, eras como un artista minimalista.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Pensaba c\u00f3mo los propios personajes, de tanto hacerlos, se vuelven como una coreograf\u00eda: podr\u00edan dibujarlos con los ojos vendados, la mano va sola. Y c\u00f3mo eso mismo genera una evoluci\u00f3n.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> A m\u00ed me confund\u00eda mucho cuando era chico y ve\u00eda los primeros Tint\u00edn, los primeros \u00c1sterix, las primeras Mafaldaa, y era diferente el personaje. En los primeros, Mafalda era un estilo de dibujito y a partir del n\u00famero 4 se estandarizaba. Yo no entend\u00eda c\u00f3mo pasaba eso, porque dec\u00eda: si inventaron el personaje, qu\u00e9 pas\u00f3, \u00bfse olvidaron de c\u00f3mo era? Y despu\u00e9s me pas\u00f3 a m\u00ed: las primeras Enriquetas tienen los ojos por all\u00e1, la nariz por ac\u00e1. Lo que pasa es que uno crea un personaje y empieza pensar y a revisitarlo, pero se dibuja de memoria, generalmente no pon\u00e9s el dibujo original al lado para copiarlo. Empez\u00e1s a dibujarlo de memoria y finalmente se acomodan.\u00a0<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Pero es imperceptible.\u00a0<\/p><p>Liniers: Hasta que los ves.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Hasta que los ves publicados en varios vol\u00famenes. Hubo una muestra en la que pon\u00edan la primera versi\u00f3n de cada uno de los personajes de historietas y la \u00faltima. Era espectacular, se ve\u00eda el primer Inodoro Pereyra y el \u00faltimo y no ten\u00edan nada que ver. El primer Clemente era una cosita chiquitita con un pico puntiagudo, que parec\u00eda un p\u00e1jaro de verdad, y la \u00faltima versi\u00f3n era todo redondeado. As\u00ed con todos, tambi\u00e9n con Mafalda.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> Es lo que habl\u00e1bamos reci\u00e9n de Clemente, primero ten\u00eda la nariz respingada, unas arrugas, en un momento tiene debajo del ojo una bolsita que no s\u00e9 si la tuvo siempre, una doble l\u00ednea\u2026<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Est\u00e1 muy bien la observaci\u00f3n, porque justamente lo que va pasando con los personajes es que van asumiendo mucho de uno, del artista, del autor. Y mi viejo era un hombre entrado en ojeras, como yo, que de a poco me voy arrimando. Yo creo que de a poco no solo uno va modificando ligera e inconscientemente al personaje, sino que este va a adoptando algunas cosas que tienen que ver \u00edntimamente con el autor.\u00a0<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Si no dibujan algo por mucho tiempo, un personaje que abandonaron por alg\u00fan motivo, \u00bfles pasa como a las bandas, que tienen que volver a ensayar? \u00bfLes pasa preguntarse c\u00f3mo era eso? \u00bfO no, nunca pasa con lo dibujado?<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> A m\u00ed me pasa. Me pidieron hace poco una Trifonia, que es una vaquita de San Antonio que dibuj\u00e9 durante un a\u00f1o hace como diez a\u00f1os en <em>La Naci\u00f3n<\/em>, y la miraba de en el libro a ver c\u00f3mo era\u2026<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Y ah\u00ed es donde los chiquitos dicen: me parece que no es Tute, porque no sabe dibujar el dibujito\u2026 Y es bastante simple Trifonia, convengamos que no te pidieron uno dif\u00edcil.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Muy simple, pero no me acordaba de c\u00f3mo eran las antenitas.<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#1a1a1a\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"18\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Fort-Book\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"27\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"i2nusnl\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p>\u00abLa irrupci\u00f3n de Liniers para m\u00ed fue muy importante porque aparecieron junto con \u00e9l un mont\u00f3n de otros dibujantes, una multiplicidad de estilos y de maneras de abordar la historieta que fue revolucionario\u00bb.<br \/><br \/>Tute<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#000000\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"40\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"24\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Vollkorn\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"45\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"30\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"95\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"95\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"30\",\"bottom\":\"50\",\"left\":\"30\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"e5rtcac\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> Una vez me dijiste, Liniers, y quiero ver si Tute comparte\u00a0y qu\u00e9 sumar\u00eda a esta lista:\u00a0\u00abLas bicicletas son jodid\u00edsimas\u00bb, de los m\u00e1s dif\u00edcil de dibujar.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Bicicletas y caballos.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Una vez hice una historieta de un caballo andando en bicicleta nada m\u00e1s que por el desaf\u00edo.\u00a0<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Y mujeres lindas. Mujeres bellas tambi\u00e9n es algo muy dif\u00edcil de dibujar.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> O sea, representar en tu universo lo que es la belleza. Pero \u00bfno se muestra con la reacci\u00f3n de otro personaje? O se le hace un <em>glow<\/em> alrededor\u2026<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Hay trampas que pod\u00e9s hacer. Te sale horrible la se\u00f1ora pero le pones rayitas y rayitas significa que est\u00e1 buena.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> \u00bfEl brillo ser\u00eda? \u00bfPor qu\u00e9 las rayitas?<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Y, yo siempre que veo chicas lindas me imagino rayitas que salen de atr\u00e1s,<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> Est\u00e1 ese personaje del que estaba enamorado Felipe\u00a0en\u00a0\u00ab\u00a0Mafalda\u00bb\u2026<\/p><p><strong>Tute y Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0(al un\u00edsono) Muriel.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> El universo no se daba cuenta de que ni Susanita ni Libertad eran esa chica.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Y, era linda Muriel, en comparaci\u00f3n con Susanita\u2026<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Era muy linda, Quino le hac\u00eda ojos 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Caro:<\/strong> Voy a algo m\u00e1s que es dif\u00edcil de dibujar. No necesariamente objetos, sino en t\u00e9rminos de acci\u00f3n, de sensaciones, de ritmo o de clima. Lo m\u00e1s dif\u00edcil de filmar es la felicidad, para poner un ejemplo de otra \u00e1rea; \u00bfqu\u00e9 es lo m\u00e1s dif\u00edcil de dibujar?<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Estoy tratando de pensar qu\u00e9\u00a0pel\u00edcula film\u00f3 bien la felicidad.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> Pocas.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> \u00bfSab\u00e9s qu\u00e9? Cuando se despierta E.T. y Elliott est\u00e1 ah\u00ed, llorando, y de repente lo ve y y la flor crece y\u2026 yo lloro.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> La alegr\u00eda es f\u00e1cil, la felicidad no. Es porque la felicidad no se sabe muy bien c\u00f3mo es.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> Es un sentimiento muy dif\u00edcil de fraguar.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Es un accidente espont\u00e1neo, entonces no tiene una estructuraci\u00f3n\u2026 \u00bfc\u00f3mo le explic\u00e1s a un actor qu\u00e9 es lo que tiene que hacer?<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> En la historieta a m\u00ed me cuesta generar una atm\u00f3sfera asfixiante. No me sale, me gustar\u00eda hacer terror, y que tenga esa cosa <em>grrr<\/em>, a lo Mariana Enr\u00edquez. \u00abEl pr\u00f3ximo libro de Liniers, GRRR\u00bb, pero no me sale.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Me parece que en la historieta tenemos un punto a favor respecto del cine: es m\u00e1s f\u00e1cil dibujar la felicidad, dibujar los sentimientos. Constantemente estamos dibujando emociones.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Alguien dijo que hacer una pel\u00edcula es como dibujar una historieta pero con cien personas moviendo el l\u00e1piz.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> David Fincher dijo eso.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Cada vez que fui a un set de cine no entend\u00ed c\u00f3mo hay una pel\u00edcula al final de eso que estaba viendo. Est\u00e1 el director parado y viene alguien y le dice \u00ab\u00bfEsta camisa est\u00e1 bien o esta?\u00bb, viene otro: \u00ab\u00bfEste filtro o este?\u00bb. Son tres millones de preguntas. Estuve todo el d\u00eda y despu\u00e9s vi la pel\u00edcula y digo: esos tres segundos estuve ah\u00ed.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Y tiene que suceder en esos tres segundos.<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#1a1a1a\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"18\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Fort-Book\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"27\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"w54i7sq\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p>\u00abEn sus novelas gr\u00e1ficas, Tute es muy generoso con sus sentimientos. Yo me escondo mucho m\u00e1s. Como lector se lo agradezco, hay que agradecer a alguien con esa generosidad. Yo soy mucho m\u00e1s amarrete para mostrarme\u00bb.<br \/><br \/>Liniers<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#000000\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"40\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"24\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Vollkorn\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"45\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"30\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"95\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"95\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"30\",\"bottom\":\"50\",\"left\":\"30\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"n1n00tz\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong> Me gustar\u00eda que hablen un poco el uno del otro. Liniers, \u00bfqu\u00e9 te llama la atenci\u00f3n particularmente del trabajo de Tute? Hacen cosas muy distintas, en el mismo universo, con distintas improntas y tem\u00e1ticas: tienen diferentes obsesiones. \u00bfC\u00f3mo se vincula uno con un contempor\u00e1neo?<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Creo que arrancamos los dos por caminos muy diferentes cuando \u00e9ramos muy chiquititos. Tute, vos creo que en las venas ten\u00e9s la tinta, y mi viejo es abogado. Creo que no hay nada m\u00e1s lejos de un dibujante de historietas que los abogados. Yo tuve un viaje raro. A Tute lo conozco por su laburo desde chiquito y al principio creo que lo que hizo fue que mam\u00f3 de su casa. Ten\u00eda el estilo como de tu viejo (Caloi) y despu\u00e9s encontraste algo y empezaste a hacer tus novelas gr\u00e1ficas. Es muy dif\u00edcil hacer algo que sea cien por ciento original en historieta,\u00a0y todas las novelas gr\u00e1ficas de \u00e9l me vuelan la cabeza, porque\u00a0es muy generoso con sus sentimientos. Cuando hace el laburo en el diario es muy generoso con hacernos re\u00edr con Rub\u00e9n y Mabel. Pero en las\u00a0novelas gr\u00e1ficas\u00a0es muy generoso con tus sentimientos. Yo me escondo mucho m\u00e1s. Como lector te lo agradezco, hay que agradecer a alguien con esa generosidad. Yo soy mucho m\u00e1s amarrete para mostrarme.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Bueno, muchas gracias.\u00a0Hay algo de la posibilidad que da la historieta de hablar de los sentimientos, y no hay que contar con todo ese equipo infernal, ese andamiaje que necesita una pel\u00edcula: uno es el director, el guionista, el vestuarista, el fot\u00f3grafo, todo, y ah\u00ed, en la soledad del estudio, del tablero, pod\u00e9s contar lo que quieras, pod\u00e9s hablar de lo que sea. Entonces, me parece que el acceso a la vida emocional es muy sencillo. De Liniers: en lo personal fue una bocanada de aire fresco en el panorama de la historieta nacional, fue espectacular la irrupci\u00f3n. Porque adem\u00e1s fue una irrupci\u00f3n, no es que fue publicando t\u00edmidamente algunas cosas sino que fue una carrera mete\u00f3rica, de pronto estaba en todas partes. Me acuerdo que mi viejo me dec\u00eda: \u00abChe, hay uno que me parece que se trae gente, Liniers, porque \u00bfqui\u00e9n es?\u00bb.<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#1a1a1a\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"18\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Fort-Book\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"27\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"sg8rdcb\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p>\u00abNo\u00a0hay dibujos inocentes, no hay dibujos que no cuenten nada. El dibujo siempre est\u00e1 conectado con uno\u00bb.<br \/><br \/>Tute<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#000000\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"40\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"24\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Vollkorn\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"45\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"30\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"95\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"95\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"30\",\"bottom\":\"50\",\"left\":\"30\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"shgu8zg\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p><\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> En\u00a02001 me llam\u00f3 Daniel Divinsky para editar <em>Bonjour<\/em> en Ediciones De la Flor y yo le dije a mi mujer: \u00abNos salvamos, esto es de verdad\u00bb pero en 2001 pasaron cosas y Daniel me dijo: \u00abBueno, Ricardo, resulta que no te vamos a publicar el libro, qu\u00e9 le vamos a hacer, pero seguro que en el futuro lo vamos a hacer\u00bb. A la\u00a0siguiente feria del libro, que fue poquito despu\u00e9s,\u00a0fui a ver la mesa de los dibujantes, porque yo iba todos los a\u00f1os, a ver hablar a Quino, a Caloi, a Fontanarrosa y a Maitena, porque eran mis h\u00e9roes, y entonces llego y me dan el diario de la feria y leo \u00abLos seis grandes del humor: Quino, Caloi, Fontanarrosa, Maitena, Rep y Liniers\u00bb. Yo no hab\u00eda publicado ni un solo libro.\u00a0Encima despu\u00e9s ten\u00eda un casamiento as\u00ed que estaba de corbata y traje, y cuando llego Daniel me dice: \u00abTe pusieron en el diario, si quer\u00e9s sub\u00ed\u00bb. Y bueno, subo. As\u00ed que estaban John, Paul, George, Ringo y\u2026 no s\u00e9, Justin Bieber\u2026 La confusi\u00f3n de la gente. Capaz que vos, Tute, estabas sentado ah\u00ed entre la gente y dec\u00edas \u00ab\u00bfY este?\u00bb.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> No, yo estaba en casa pero cuando lleg\u00f3 mi viejo me dijo eso: \u00abChe estaba uno que se llama Liniers, que se ve que tiene muchos amigos, la gente lo aplaud\u00eda\u00bb. Y entonces esa irrupci\u00f3n para m\u00ed\u00a0fue muy importante porque aparecieron junto con Liniers un mont\u00f3n de otros dibujantes, un colectivo incluso que se llamaba Historietas Reales, que eran historietas autobiogr\u00e1ficas y se turnaban y hab\u00eda una multiplicidad de estilos y de maneras de abordar la historieta que fue revolucionario. Yo ven\u00eda de la escuela de mi viejo, de Quino, del negro Fontanarrosa, Sendra, Tabar\u00e9, Maicas, mis consumos eran esos. No ten\u00eda relaci\u00f3n con los j\u00f3venes, eran los veteranos los que me hab\u00edan ense\u00f1ado. Entonces apareci\u00f3 Liniers, haciendo chistes que por ah\u00ed no ten\u00edan remate, una cosa que era rar\u00edsima ac\u00e1. Fue muy importante porque creo que, con el tiempo, lo que hice fue dejar una pata de cada lado. Todav\u00eda tengo una pata instalada en lo cl\u00e1sico, en la tradici\u00f3n, y otra en esta vertiente m\u00e1s joven y que de alguna manera impulsaba Liniers.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Yo soy de una generaci\u00f3n en la que para aprender a hacer historietas ten\u00edas primero que publicar y as\u00ed te fogueabas. Era muy dif\u00edcil entrar en un diario o en una revista, y con internet vimos crecer a un mont\u00f3n de gente llegaban a su libro arm\u00e1ndolo lentamente en la web,\u00a0 gente como 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Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Hay una caracter\u00edstica que s\u00e9 que tiene Liniers, que es que siempre tiene las manos siempre manchadas. Parece Basquiat, est\u00e1 siempre dibujando. No s\u00e9 si vos, Tute, est\u00e1s dibujando todo el tiempo tambi\u00e9n.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong>\u00a0Dibujo todos los d\u00edas porque es mi trabajo, pero no soy un dibujante compulsivo, Liniers creo que lo es un poco m\u00e1s. Hubo casos de mayor compulsi\u00f3n todav\u00eda, como el del Negro Crist, que pasaba m\u00e1s tiempo dibujando que no. De verdad, de 24 horas del d\u00eda, restale ocho horas de sue\u00f1o y el resto estaba dibujando. Ibas a morfar con el negro y met\u00eda el dedo en la copa de vino y pintaba los dibujos con vino tinto, que es una maravilla. Pero yo nunca tuve esa compulsi\u00f3n. Puedo pasar unos d\u00edas sin dibujar, pero despu\u00e9s me dan ganas de dibujar de vuelta, tengo esa cosa medio pueril.\u00a0Hay una energ\u00eda infantil, me parece, en la pulsi\u00f3n de dibujar.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0A m\u00ed lo que me pasa es que dibujo para ver qu\u00e9 pasa.\u00a0Me gusta mucho esa tira de Mafalda en la que Guille dice \u00ab\u00bfViste todo lo que cabe adentro de un l\u00e1piz?\u00bb. Dibujo por la misma raz\u00f3n por la que leo o veo una pel\u00edcula: para ver qu\u00e9 va pasar. Hay algo relajante en eso para m\u00ed.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong>\u00a0Y hay una b\u00fasqueda tambi\u00e9n, porque muchas veces a la idea se accede a trav\u00e9s del dibujo, no del pensamiento, no del di\u00e1logo como texto intelectual que surge y al que despu\u00e9s uno le agrega un dibujo. Surge a partir del dibujo: arrancamos a dibujar y a trav\u00e9s de ese dibujo inconsciente se va armando algo.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Pensamos con la mano. La mano pensante.\u00a0<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong>\u00a0El trazo que piensa.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Me acuerdo de la locura de un n\u00famero de\u00a0<em>Macanudo<\/em>\u00a0que hiciste en el que todas las tapas eran originales.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0S\u00ed, una estupidez. Fue cuando empezamos con mi mujer la editorial Com\u00fan hace un tiempo.\u00a0 Sali\u00f3 de un chiste que me hizo Kuki Miller en una comida. Yo hab\u00eda hecho la primera tapa de\u00a0<span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><em><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/tiempo-libre\/37323-libro-macanudo-1-9788417511197\\\">Macanudo<\/a><\/em><\/span>\u00a0con acuarela, la segunda la pint\u00e9 en un acr\u00edlico y la tercera la bord\u00e9. Y Kuki me dice: \u00abQu\u00e9 pesado, un d\u00eda las vas a dibujar todas a mano\u00bb, y todos se rieron, jajaja, y yo abr\u00ed grande los ojos. Despu\u00e9s me dio no s\u00e9 qu\u00e9 pedirle a Daniel Divinsky semejante locura: publicame un mont\u00f3n de libros sin tapa que yo despu\u00e9s las dibujo.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00bfTen\u00eda un marco vac\u00edo la tapa?<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Cuando Angie y yo empezamos con la editorial, era nuestra plata. \u00cdbamos a la imprenta y nos miraban como si tuvi\u00e9ramos una enfermedad rara. Angie me dec\u00eda \u00abHac\u00e9 mil y despu\u00e9s los otros los imprimimos como post Gutenberg\u00bb y yo le dije: \u00abNo, tiene que ser un n\u00famero m\u00e1s \u00e9pico.\u00a0No s\u00e9 por qu\u00e9, un tarado. \u00c9pico. \u00c9pico\u00bb. Y entonces imprimimos cinco mil y los mandamos a mi casa y no medimos un mont\u00f3n de cosas por no ser editores como la gente, como que cinco mil libros, primero, ocupan un mont\u00f3n de lugar; segundo, tienen todos olor a pegamento.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Te vas drogando\u2026<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Est\u00e1bamos todos drogados en la casa: mi mujer, yo, y Matilda, que ten\u00eda un a\u00f1o. Todos teniendo unos sue\u00f1os rar\u00edsimos. Despu\u00e9s, cuando iba dibujando la tapa n\u00famero\u00a0trescientos dec\u00eda: \u00abEh, esto es vanguardia. 301, mir\u00e1, Fellini\u00bb. Cuando iba por la tres mil, lloraba. Ven\u00eda Angie y me dec\u00eda\u00a0que el distribuidor\u00a0quer\u00eda doscientas\u00a0m\u00e1s. \u00a1No, no por favor! Ya para el final, n\u00famero cuatro mil, est\u00e1n todos mal dibujados, con l\u00e1grimas 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Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Quiero hacerle un homenaje tambi\u00e9n a Daniel Divinsky, por c\u00f3mo nos cambi\u00f3 la vida para siempre. Les tengo que pedir que me digan un top tres de libros de De La Flor, tres que por alg\u00fan motivo sea de esas lecturas esenciales, puede ser una novela de Fontanarrosa, historieta, Caloi, Quino\u2026<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong> Top uno es <em>Mafalda 3,<\/em> el primer libro que le\u00ed solito. Yo ten\u00eda seis a\u00f1os y me dieron <em>Mafalda<\/em> y sent\u00eda que terminaba la tira y ya hab\u00eda le\u00eddo un cuento entero. La influencia de Quino no es como historietista, es como ser humano. Segundo: hubo una biograf\u00eda de Meli\u00e9s, que probablemente Daniel ni se\u00a0acuerda que edit\u00f3 y que debe haber vendido cuatro ejemplares. Estaba escrito por la nieta de Meli\u00e9s, yo lo agarr\u00e9 cuando el libro llevaba unos\u00a0quince a\u00f1os publicado y se me fue desarmando, lo termin\u00e9 leyendo de a pedacitos, pero una belleza ese libro. Y tercero, <em>Macanudo 1<\/em>, que todav\u00eda no lo puedo creer: \u00bfme estas jodiendo? \u00a1Ediciones De la Flor!!\u00a0 \u00a1Autobombo!<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> El sue\u00f1o de todo dibujante era publicar en ediciones De la Flor y adem\u00e1s era la \u00fanica editorial que se ocupaba del humor gr\u00e1fico. No hab\u00eda muchas otras opciones y verdaderamente era el sue\u00f1o de todos, y m\u00edo tambi\u00e9n. En un momento lo llegu\u00e9 a convencer a Daniel. Yo todav\u00eda no reun\u00eda el suficiente material para justificar un volumen, entonces me arrim\u00e9 a otros dibujantes que tambi\u00e9n estaban empezando pero ten\u00edan m\u00e1s material, eran m\u00e1s grandes que yo: uno era el querido Dani The O, otro era El Ruso, que era como firmaba en esa \u00e9poca Emilio Ferrero, y Marito. Y entonces, a fuerza de ir pr\u00e1cticamente todos los d\u00edas a golpearle la puerta Daniel me dijo: \u00abBueno, dale, dale, junt\u00e1 a esta gente y hac\u00e9 algo\u00bb. Es muy gracioso el libro, se llama <em>Nuevos humoristas argentinos<\/em> y sali\u00f3 en el a\u00f1o 95 creo, o sea, yo ten\u00eda veinti\u00fan a\u00f1os, y todas las fotos de los dibujantes en el estudio eran en mi tablero, as\u00ed que estamos todos en el mismo lugar, y con unos dibujos, en mi caso particular, impresentables, porque era muy inici\u00e1ticos. Eran dibujos con mucha influencia de mi viejo, todav\u00eda much\u00edsima, y justo cuando me ofrecieron un contrato en Sudamericana, me llam\u00f3 Daniel para hacer algo. Justo la misma semana en que hab\u00eda firmado con Sudamericana, editorial con la que continu\u00e9 hasta el d\u00eda de hoy: si no, hubiera seguido con ediciones De La Flor.<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00bfY libros hist\u00f3ricos de De la Flor que te hayan marcado?<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong> Todos, todos, sobre todo los diez vol\u00famenes de <em>Mafalda. <\/em>Todav\u00eda conservo los primeros que le\u00ed. La otra vez vinieron de Nat Geo para hacer un documental sobre Mafalda y se los mostraba: algunos ajados, amarillentos y los conservo y sigo comprando los diez vol\u00famenes para las nuevas generaciones y les digo: ojo, esto t\u00e9nganlo, l\u00e9anlo. El de Ediciones De la Flor es un reconocimiento que hay que hacer porque es una casa editorial amiga de los autores que ha acompa\u00f1ado la vida de los dibujantes, no solo en t\u00e9rminos comerciales, sino que han sido amigos de Quino, de Alicia, de mi viejo y de los j\u00f3venes tambi\u00e9n, y han estado en el exilio en \u00e9pocas de dictadura. Para los dibujantes fue un refugio durante mucho tiempo, en tiempos muy 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Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Tambi\u00e9n hubo otras como la colecci\u00f3n Hyspamerica de humor argentino, donde aparec\u00edan compiladas cosas que uno hab\u00eda le\u00eddo, como el libro de Grondona White, el de Crist, cosas que eran incre\u00edbles.\u00a0<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Y la Urraca, que fue otra editorial que ten\u00edamos ah\u00ed arriba.\u00a0Cuando apareci\u00f3 la revista\u00a0<em>Fierro<\/em>\u00a0en mi vida, me dij\u00e9 \u00abMir\u00e1 todas las cosas que se pueden hacer con la historieta\u00bb. Ve\u00edas las tiras de Max Cachimba, que es un dibujante rosarino\u2026<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00d3xido, est\u00e1s hablando del suplemento \u00d3xido de\u00a0<em>Fierro<\/em>.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0\u00d3xido. Es uno de mis h\u00e9roes absolutos Max Cachimba. Cada vez que entend\u00eda lo que hac\u00eda, \u00e9l ya hab\u00eda saltado para adelante. Ve\u00edas lo nuevo y dec\u00edas \u00abAh, no, a m\u00eda me gustaba lo anterior\u00bb\u00a0pero entonces lo entend\u00edas y \u00e9l ya hab\u00eda saltado de nuevo para adelante.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong>\u00a0Recomiendo de Max Cachimba un libro muy chiquitito, muy finito pero genial, llamado\u00a0<em>Humor idiota<\/em>.<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Estuve dando unas clases en Estados Unidos de historia de la historieta latinoamericana en el departamento de Espa\u00f1ol de una universidad muy cara, Dartmouth. Los padres pagan un mont\u00f3n de dinero pensando tal vez que sus hijos van a ser abogados y, \u00abOh, Brian, \u00bfqu\u00e9 est\u00e1s haciendo? Estoy estudiando\u00a0<em>El Eternauta<\/em>,\u00a0<em>Mafalda<\/em>\u00bb.\u00a0Revisando para dar estas clases me encontr\u00e9 con que este pa\u00eds ha dado una cantidad de material y de talento bestial. Y entonces vas a Europa, y te abren las puertas por los que vinieron antes.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong>\u00a0No s\u00e9 qu\u00e9 es pero de ac\u00e1 salieron tipos como Quino, como Altuna, como Nine, como el Menchi S\u00e1bat, como mi viejo, como Jos\u00e9 Mu\u00f1oz, que es un tipo que ac\u00e1 no lo juna nadie y es dios, ha influenciado a los grandes autores del planeta, incluso en el cine. No lo juna nadie y es incre\u00edble, es el mejor.<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#1a1a1a\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"18\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Fort-Book\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"27\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"ti3b2q4\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p>\u00abDibujo para ver qu\u00e9 pasa.\u00a0Me gusta mucho esa tira de <em>Mafalda<\/em> en la que Guille dice \\\"\u00bfViste todo lo que cabe adentro de un l\u00e1piz?\\\". Dibujo por la misma raz\u00f3n por la que leo o veo una pel\u00edcula: para ver qu\u00e9 va pasar\u00bb.<br \/><br \/>Liniers<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#000000\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"40\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"24\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Vollkorn\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"45\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"30\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"95\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"95\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"30\",\"bottom\":\"50\",\"left\":\"30\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"1q5eppm\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Vamos a cerrar con una pregunta del p\u00fablico, de una ni\u00f1a, Vera. La pregunta es si todos los personajes tienen algo que les pas\u00f3 a ustedes.\u00a0<\/p><p><strong>Liniers:<\/strong>\u00a0Muy linda pregunta. Yo con algunos personajes hago memoria, trato de acordarme c\u00f3mo era tener su edad, sobre todo con Enriqueta y Martincito. Para nosotros. Mafalda era muy importante. Yo no pod\u00eda hacer Mafalda; lo que hice fue mantener a Enriqueta en la infancia. Es como un puente. Trato de que no se me borre c\u00f3mo sent\u00eda yo cuando era chiquito.\u00a0Me recuerdo en mi cama, calentito, con los libros de la colecci\u00f3n Robin Hood, y mis padres en su habitaci\u00f3n y mi hermana en la suya y me sent\u00eda bien y protegido, as\u00ed que trat\u00e9 de mantener a Enriqueta en esa edad. Despu\u00e9s, el Hombre Misterioso, yo soy bastante misterioso, \u00bfqui\u00e9n es ese hombre de barba que va por ah\u00ed?, preguntan, y soy yo. Y el robot sensible: yo lloro. Mis hijas saben que en El regreso del Jedi lloro. Lloro mucho. Y as\u00ed: todos los personajes tienen un pedacito m\u00edo.\u00a0<\/p><p><strong>De Caro:<\/strong>\u00a0Tute, que public\u00f3\u00a0<span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/ar\/comic\/146510-libro-diario-de-un-hijo-9789500762540\\\"><em>Diario de un hijo<\/em>,<\/a><\/span>\u00a0le puede contestar a la ni\u00f1a tambi\u00e9n.<\/p><p><strong>Tute:<\/strong>\u00a0El dibujo te da la posibilidad de conectarte con tus emociones. Dibujando, un ni\u00f1o, una ni\u00f1a, de la edad que sea, lo que est\u00e1 haciendo siempre es explic\u00e1ndose el mundo a trav\u00e9s del dibujo, se est\u00e1 conectando. No\u00a0hay dibujos inocentes, no hay dibujos que no cuenten nada. Siempre tienen una relaci\u00f3n, aunque sea \u00edntima y de alg\u00fan modo autobiogr\u00e1fica, con tu propia realidad, sea porque te interesa, sea porque te pas\u00f3, sea porque lo dese\u00e1s, porque te duele. El dibujo siempre est\u00e1 conectado con uno.<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#1a1a1a\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"18\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Fort-Book\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"27\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"cmi6fat\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p><\/p><p><br \/><strong>OTROS CONTENIDOS DE INTER\u00c9S:<\/strong><em><br \/><br \/><\/em><\/p><p><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/revista-lengua\/entrevistas\/tute-caloi\\\">Tute: \u00abLo m\u00e1s importante es el deseo; el deseo desaf\u00eda a la muerte\u00bb<\/a><\/span><\/p><p><\/p><p><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/revista-lengua\/entrevistas\/art-spiegelman-liniers\\\">Art Spiegelman: \u00abAuschwitz estaba en mi patio trasero: era mi casa\u00bb<\/a><\/span><\/p><p><\/p><p><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/revista-lengua\/despedidas\/obituario-quino\\\">Apuntes para (re)conocer a Quino<\/a><\/span><\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#1a1a1a\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"18\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Fort-Book\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"27\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"58\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}}],\"editSettings\":{}}],\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"cubtjw4\",\"elType\":\"section\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_layout\":\"\",\"stretch_section\":\"section-stretched\",\"layout\":\"full_width\",\"content_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"gap\":\"default\",\"height\":\"default\",\"custom_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":400},\"column_position\":\"middle\",\"content_position\":\"\",\"structure\":\"10\",\"section_background\":\"\",\"background_background\":\"\",\"background_color\":\"\",\"background_color_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":0},\"background_color_b\":\"\",\"background_color_b_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":100},\"background_gradient_type\":\"linear\",\"background_gradient_angle\":{\"unit\":\"deg\",\"size\":180},\"background_gradient_position\":\"center 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