Gabriel García Márquez

Un diálogo único entre García Márquez y Vargas Llosa: para saber qué es la soledad

Después de casi medio siglo circulando en inconseguibles fotocopias universitarias, «Dos soledades» rescata un momento único: los dos días en que Gabriel García Márquez y Mario Vargas Llosa se sentaron a hablar en público de literatura. Fue en la Universidad Nacional de Ingeniería de Lima y el diálogo tiene a dos amigos recorriendo con lucidez y frescura temas y nombres como Latinoamérica, la revolución, el Boom, la política, Cortázar, Fuentes, Faulkner, Borges, la tradición europea y la posibilidad de escribir la Gran Novela Latinoamericana entre todos. Este fragmento que reproducimos es apenas una muestra exquisita, un momento en que los dos se adentran en el verdadero significado de la soledad y su inesperada relación con la fundación de Macondo.

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\/>Por <span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/lengua\/gabriel-garcia-marquez\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">GABRIEL GARC\u00cdA M\u00c1RQUEZ<\/a><\/span>\u00a0Y\u00a0<span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/104494-mario-vargas-llosa\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">MARIO VARGAS LLOSA<\/a><\/span><br \/><br \/><br 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class=\\\"MsoNormal\\\"><strong>Mario Vargas Llosa:<\/strong> Quisiera hacerte una pregunta m\u00e1s personal, porque al hablar de la soledad yo recordaba que es un tema constante en todos tus libros; incluso el \u00faltimo se llama, precisamente, <span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><em><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/literatura-contemporanea\/7401-cien-anos-de-soledad-edicion-conmemorativa-de-la-rae-y-la-asale-edicion-conmemorativa-de-la-rae-y-la-asale-9788420471839\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">Cien a\u00f1os de soledad<\/a><\/em><\/span>, y es curioso, porque tus libros siempre est\u00e1n muy poblados o son muy populosos, est\u00e1n llenos de gente; sin embargo, son libros cuya materia profunda es, en cierto modo, la soledad. En muchos reportajes que has respondido, he observado que te refieres siempre a un familiar tuyo que te cont\u00f3 muchas historias cuando eras ni\u00f1o. Incluso, recuerdo un reportaje en que dec\u00edas que la muerte de ese familiar, cuando ten\u00edas ocho a\u00f1os, fue el \u00faltimo acontecimiento importante de tu vida. Entonces, tal vez ser\u00eda interesante que nos dijeras en qu\u00e9 medida este personaje puede haber servido de est\u00edmulo, puede haber dado materiales para tus libros. Es decir, \u00bfqui\u00e9n es este personaje, en primer lugar?\u00a0<\/p><p class=\\\"MsoNormal\\\"><strong><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/581-gabriel-garcia-marquez\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">Gabriel Garc\u00eda M\u00e1rquez<\/a><\/span>:<\/strong> Voy a dar una vuelta antes de llegar a la respuesta. En realidad, no conozco a nadie que en cierta medida no se sienta solo. Este es el significado de la soledad que a m\u00ed me interesa. Temo que esto sea metaf\u00edsico y que sea reaccionario y que parezca todo lo contrario de lo que yo soy, de lo que yo quiero ser en realidad, pero creo que el hombre est\u00e1 completamente solo.<\/p><p class=\\\"MsoNormal\\\"><strong>Mario Vargas Llosa:<\/strong> \u00bfT\u00fa crees que es una caracter\u00edstica del hombre?<\/p><p class=\\\"MsoNormal\\\"><strong>Gabriel Garc\u00eda M\u00e1rquez:<\/strong> Yo creo que es parte esencial de la naturaleza 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class=\\\"MsoNormal\\\" style=\\\"text-align: left;\\\"><strong>Mario Vargas Llosa:<\/strong> Pero mi pregunta iba a esto: yo he le\u00eddo un discurso, en un ensayo muy largo que public\u00f3 una revista en Par\u00eds sobre tus libros, que esa soledad, el contenido principal de\u00a0<em><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/literatura-contemporanea\/7401-cien-anos-de-soledad-edicion-conmemorativa-de-la-rae-y-la-asale-edicion-conmemorativa-de-la-rae-y-la-asale-9788420471839\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">Cien a\u00f1os de soledad<\/a><\/span><\/em> y de los libros anteriores tuyos era la caracter\u00edstica del hombre americano, pues estaba representando la profunda alienaci\u00f3n del hombre americano, la incomunicaci\u00f3n que existe entre los hombres, el hecho de que el hombre americano surge de una serie de condicionamientos; es decir, que est\u00e1 condenado a una especie de desencuentro con la realidad y esto lo hace sentirse frustrado, mutilado, solitario. \u00bfQu\u00e9 piensas t\u00fa de esta observaci\u00f3n?<\/p><p class=\\\"MsoNormal\\\" style=\\\"text-align: left;\\\"><strong>Gabriel Garc\u00eda M\u00e1rquez:<\/strong> No lo hab\u00eda pensado. Sucede que estos valores son totalmente inconscientes. Yo creo, adem\u00e1s, que estoy meti\u00e9ndome en un terreno peligroso, que es el de tratar de explicarme esta soledad que yo expreso y que trato de buscar en distintas facetas del individuo. Creo que el d\u00eda que sea consciente, que sepa exactamente de d\u00f3nde viene esto, no me va a servir m\u00e1s. Por ejemplo: hay un cr\u00edtico en Colombia que escribi\u00f3 una cosa muy completa sobre mis libros; dec\u00eda que notaba que las mujeres que figuran en mis libros son la seguridad, son el sentido com\u00fan, son las que mantienen la casta y el uso de la raz\u00f3n en la familia, mientras los hombres andan haciendo toda clase de aventuras, y\u00e9ndose a las guerras y tratando de explorar y fundar pueblos, que siempre terminan en fracasos espectaculares, y gracias a la mujer, que est\u00e1 en la casa \u2014manteniendo, digamos, la tradici\u00f3n, los primeros valores\u2014, los hombres han podido hacer las guerras y han podido fundar pueblos y han podido hacer las grandes colonizaciones de Am\u00e9rica, \u00bfverdad? En el momento en que yo le\u00ed esto, revis\u00e9 mis libros anteriores y me di cuenta de que era cierto, y creo que este cr\u00edtico me hizo mucho da\u00f1o, porque precisamente me hizo la revelaci\u00f3n cuando ya estaba escribiendo <em>Cien a\u00f1os de soledad,<\/em> en donde parece que est\u00e1 la apoteosis de esto. All\u00ed hay un personaje, que es \u00darsula, que vive ciento setenta a\u00f1os, y es la que sostiene realmente toda la novela. A partir de este personaje \u2014que ya ten\u00eda completamente concebido, completamente planeado\u2014 ya no sab\u00eda si yo era sincero o estaba tratando de dar gusto a este cr\u00edtico. Entonces temo que me vaya a suceder lo mismo con la soledad. Si logro explicarme exactamente de qu\u00e9 se trata, entonces quiz\u00e1 ya sea totalmente racional, totalmente consciente, y que ya no me siga preocupando. Ahora t\u00fa me acabas de dar una clave que me asusta un poco. Yo pens\u00e9 que la soledad era com\u00fan a la naturaleza humana, pero ahora me pongo a pensar que probablemente sea un resultado de la alienaci\u00f3n del hombre latinoamericano y que entonces estoy expresando desde el punto de vista social, e inclusive desde el punto de vista pol\u00edtico, mucho m\u00e1s de lo que cre\u00eda. Si as\u00ed fuese, ya no ser\u00eda tan metaf\u00edsico como temo. He querido ser sincero de todas maneras y he trabajado aun con el temor de que eso de la soledad pueda ser un poco reaccionario, 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style=\\\"text-align: right;\\\">Gabriel Garc\u00eda M\u00e1rquez y Mario Vargas Llosa en la UNI. Sobresale el rostro de Jos\u00e9 Miguel Oviedo. Lima, 7 de septiembre de 1967. D. R.<\/p>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"\",\"typography_typography\":\"\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"clducog\",\"elType\":\"widget\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_editor\":\"\",\"editor\":\"<p style=\\\"text-align: left;\\\"><br \/><strong>Mario Vargas Llosa:<\/strong> Bueno, entonces no hablemos de la soledad en vista de que es un tema un poco peligroso. Pero yo he estado muy interesado en ese personaje familiar tuyo del que todo el mundo habla en los reportajes y al que dices deber tanto. \u00bfSe trata de una t\u00eda?<\/p><p style=\\\"text-align: left;\\\"><strong>Gabriel Garc\u00eda M\u00e1rquez:<\/strong> No. Era mi abuelo. F\u00edjense que era un se\u00f1or que yo encuentro despu\u00e9s en mi libro. \u00c9l, en alguna ocasi\u00f3n, tuvo que matar a un hombre, siendo muy joven. \u00c9l viv\u00eda en un pueblo y parece que hab\u00eda alguien que lo molestaba mucho y lo desafiaba, pero \u00e9l no le hac\u00eda caso, hasta que lleg\u00f3 a ser tan dif\u00edcil su situaci\u00f3n que, sencillamente, le peg\u00f3 un tiro. Parece que el pueblo estaba tan de acuerdo con lo que hizo que uno de los hermanos del muerto durmi\u00f3 atravesado, esa noche, en la puerta de la casa, ante el cuarto de mi abuelo, para evitar que la familia del difunto viniera a vengarlo. Entonces mi abuelo, que ya no pod\u00eda soportar la amenaza que exist\u00eda contra \u00e9l en ese pueblo, se fue a otra parte; es decir, no se fue a otro pueblo: se fue lejos con su familia y fund\u00f3 un pueblo.<\/p><p style=\\\"text-align: left;\\\"><strong>Mario Vargas Llosa:<\/strong> Bueno, es un poco el comienzo de la historia de <em>Cien a\u00f1os de soledad,<\/em> donde el primer Jos\u00e9 Arcadio mata a un hombre y tiene, en primer lugar, un terrible remordimiento, un terrible cargo de conciencia, que es el que lo obliga a abandonar su pueblo, a cruzar las monta\u00f1as y a fundar el m\u00edtico\u00a0<a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/lengua\/gabriel-garcia-marquez\/monologo-de-isabel-viendo-llover-en-macondo\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\"><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\">Macondo<\/span>.<\/a><\/p><p style=\\\"text-align: left;\\\"><strong>Gabriel Garc\u00eda M\u00e1rquez:<\/strong> S\u00ed. \u00c9l se fue y fund\u00f3 un pueblo, y lo que yo m\u00e1s recuerdo de mi abuelo es que siempre me dec\u00eda: \u00abT\u00fa no sabes lo que pesa un muerto\u00bb. Hay otra cosa que no olvido jam\u00e1s, que creo que tiene mucho que ver conmigo como escritor, y es una noche que me llev\u00f3 al circo y vimos un dromedario; al regreso, cuando llegamos a casa, abri\u00f3 un diccionario y me dijo: \u00abEste es el dromedario y el elefante, esta es la diferencia entre el dromedario y el camello\u00bb; en fin, me dio una clase de zoolog\u00eda. De esa manera yo me acostumbr\u00e9 a usar el diccionario.<br \/><br \/><br \/><strong>OTROS CONTENIDOS DE INTER\u00c9S:<\/strong><\/p><ul><li><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/lengua\/gabriel-garcia-marquez\/monologo-de-isabel-viendo-llover-en-macondo\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">Mon\u00f3logo de Isabel viendo llover en Macondo<\/a><\/span><\/li><li><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/lengua\/gabriel-garcia-marquez\/Gabriel-garcia-marquez-camino-a-macondo\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">Camino a Macondo<\/a><\/span><\/li><li><span style=\\\"text-decoration: underline;\\\"><a href=\\\"https:\/\/www.penguinlibros.com\/es\/lengua\/entrevistas\/pilar-quintana-los-abismos-alfaguara\\\" target=\\\"_blank\\\">Pilar Quintana: en la espesura del deseo<\/a><\/span><\/li><\/ul>\",\"section_style\":\"\",\"align\":\"\",\"align_tablet\":\"\",\"align_mobile\":\"\",\"text_color\":\"#1a1a1a\",\"typography_typography\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_size\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"18\"},\"typography_font_size_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_size_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_font_family\":\"custom\",\"typography_font_family_custom\":\"Fort-Book\",\"typography_font_weight\":\"\",\"typography_text_transform\":\"\",\"typography_font_style\":\"\",\"typography_line_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"27\"},\"typography_line_height_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_line_height_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"em\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"typography_letter_spacing_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"_section_style\":\"\",\"_margin\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"0\",\"right\":\"0\",\"bottom\":\"45\",\"left\":\"0\",\"isLinked\":false},\"_margin_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_margin_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_tablet\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_padding_mobile\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_animation\":\"\",\"animation_duration\":\"\",\"_css_classes\":\"\",\"_section_background\":\"\",\"_background_background\":\"\",\"_background_color\":\"\",\"_background_image\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_background_position\":\"\",\"_background_attachment\":\"\",\"_background_repeat\":\"\",\"_background_size\":\"\",\"_background_video_link\":\"\",\"_background_video_fallback\":{\"url\":\"\",\"id\":\"\"},\"_border_border\":\"\",\"_border_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_border_color\":\"\",\"_border_radius\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"top\":\"\",\"right\":\"\",\"bottom\":\"\",\"left\":\"\",\"isLinked\":true},\"_box_shadow_box_shadow_type\":\"\",\"_box_shadow_box_shadow\":{\"horizontal\":0,\"vertical\":0,\"blur\":10,\"spread\":0,\"inset\":\"\",\"color\":\"rgba(0,0,0,0.5)\"},\"_section_responsive\":\"\",\"responsive_description\":\"\",\"hide_desktop\":\"\",\"hide_tablet\":\"\",\"hide_mobile\":\"\"},\"defaultEditSettings\":[],\"widgetType\":\"text-editor\",\"editSettings\":{}}],\"editSettings\":{}}],\"editSettings\":{}},{\"id\":\"w9fw2fj\",\"elType\":\"section\",\"isInner\":false,\"settings\":{\"section_layout\":\"\",\"stretch_section\":\"section-stretched\",\"layout\":\"full_width\",\"content_width\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":\"\"},\"gap\":\"default\",\"height\":\"default\",\"custom_height\":{\"unit\":\"px\",\"size\":400},\"column_position\":\"middle\",\"content_position\":\"\",\"structure\":\"10\",\"section_background\":\"\",\"background_background\":\"\",\"background_color\":\"\",\"background_color_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":0},\"background_color_b\":\"\",\"background_color_b_stop\":{\"unit\":\"%\",\"size\":100},\"background_gradient_type\":\"linear\",\"background_gradient_angle\":{\"unit\":\"deg\",\"size\":180},\"background_gradient_position\":\"center 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10 minutos

Gabriel García Márquez y Mario Vargas Llosa en la casa Agurto. Lima, 8 de septiembre de 1967. D. R.

Mario Vargas Llosa: Quisiera hacerte una pregunta más personal, porque al hablar de la soledad yo recordaba que es un tema constante en todos tus libros; incluso el último se llama, precisamente, Cien años de soledad, y es curioso, porque tus libros siempre están muy poblados o son muy populosos, están llenos de gente; sin embargo, son libros cuya materia profunda es, en cierto modo, la soledad. En muchos reportajes que has respondido, he observado que te refieres siempre a un familiar tuyo que te contó muchas historias cuando eras niño. Incluso, recuerdo un reportaje en que decías que la muerte de ese familiar, cuando tenías ocho años, fue el último acontecimiento importante de tu vida. Entonces, tal vez sería interesante que nos dijeras en qué medida este personaje puede haber servido de estímulo, puede haber dado materiales para tus libros. Es decir, ¿quién es este personaje, en primer lugar? 

Gabriel García Márquez: Voy a dar una vuelta antes de llegar a la respuesta. En realidad, no conozco a nadie que en cierta medida no se sienta solo. Este es el significado de la soledad que a mí me interesa. Temo que esto sea metafísico y que sea reaccionario y que parezca todo lo contrario de lo que yo soy, de lo que yo quiero ser en realidad, pero creo que el hombre está completamente solo.

Mario Vargas Llosa: ¿Tú crees que es una característica del hombre?

Gabriel García Márquez: Yo creo que es parte esencial de la naturaleza humana.

Mario Vargas Llosa: Pero mi pregunta iba a esto: yo he leído un discurso, en un ensayo muy largo que publicó una revista en París sobre tus libros, que esa soledad, el contenido principal de Cien años de soledad y de los libros anteriores tuyos era la característica del hombre americano, pues estaba representando la profunda alienación del hombre americano, la incomunicación que existe entre los hombres, el hecho de que el hombre americano surge de una serie de condicionamientos; es decir, que está condenado a una especie de desencuentro con la realidad y esto lo hace sentirse frustrado, mutilado, solitario. ¿Qué piensas tú de esta observación?

Gabriel García Márquez: No lo había pensado. Sucede que estos valores son totalmente inconscientes. Yo creo, además, que estoy metiéndome en un terreno peligroso, que es el de tratar de explicarme esta soledad que yo expreso y que trato de buscar en distintas facetas del individuo. Creo que el día que sea consciente, que sepa exactamente de dónde viene esto, no me va a servir más. Por ejemplo: hay un crítico en Colombia que escribió una cosa muy completa sobre mis libros; decía que notaba que las mujeres que figuran en mis libros son la seguridad, son el sentido común, son las que mantienen la casta y el uso de la razón en la familia, mientras los hombres andan haciendo toda clase de aventuras, yéndose a las guerras y tratando de explorar y fundar pueblos, que siempre terminan en fracasos espectaculares, y gracias a la mujer, que está en la casa —manteniendo, digamos, la tradición, los primeros valores—, los hombres han podido hacer las guerras y han podido fundar pueblos y han podido hacer las grandes colonizaciones de América, ¿verdad? En el momento en que yo leí esto, revisé mis libros anteriores y me di cuenta de que era cierto, y creo que este crítico me hizo mucho daño, porque precisamente me hizo la revelación cuando ya estaba escribiendo Cien años de soledad, en donde parece que está la apoteosis de esto. Allí hay un personaje, que es Úrsula, que vive ciento setenta años, y es la que sostiene realmente toda la novela. A partir de este personaje —que ya tenía completamente concebido, completamente planeado— ya no sabía si yo era sincero o estaba tratando de dar gusto a este crítico. Entonces temo que me vaya a suceder lo mismo con la soledad. Si logro explicarme exactamente de qué se trata, entonces quizá ya sea totalmente racional, totalmente consciente, y que ya no me siga preocupando. Ahora tú me acabas de dar una clave que me asusta un poco. Yo pensé que la soledad era común a la naturaleza humana, pero ahora me pongo a pensar que probablemente sea un resultado de la alienación del hombre latinoamericano y que entonces estoy expresando desde el punto de vista social, e inclusive desde el punto de vista político, mucho más de lo que creía. Si así fuese, ya no sería tan metafísico como temo. He querido ser sincero de todas maneras y he trabajado aun con el temor de que eso de la soledad pueda ser un poco reaccionario, ¿verdad?

Gabriel García Márquez y Mario Vargas Llosa en la UNI. Sobresale el rostro de José Miguel Oviedo. Lima, 7 de septiembre de 1967. D. R.


Mario Vargas Llosa: Bueno, entonces no hablemos de la soledad en vista de que es un tema un poco peligroso. Pero yo he estado muy interesado en ese personaje familiar tuyo del que todo el mundo habla en los reportajes y al que dices deber tanto. ¿Se trata de una tía?

Gabriel García Márquez: No. Era mi abuelo. Fíjense que era un señor que yo encuentro después en mi libro. Él, en alguna ocasión, tuvo que matar a un hombre, siendo muy joven. Él vivía en un pueblo y parece que había alguien que lo molestaba mucho y lo desafiaba, pero él no le hacía caso, hasta que llegó a ser tan difícil su situación que, sencillamente, le pegó un tiro. Parece que el pueblo estaba tan de acuerdo con lo que hizo que uno de los hermanos del muerto durmió atravesado, esa noche, en la puerta de la casa, ante el cuarto de mi abuelo, para evitar que la familia del difunto viniera a vengarlo. Entonces mi abuelo, que ya no podía soportar la amenaza que existía contra él en ese pueblo, se fue a otra parte; es decir, no se fue a otro pueblo: se fue lejos con su familia y fundó un pueblo.

Mario Vargas Llosa: Bueno, es un poco el comienzo de la historia de Cien años de soledad, donde el primer José Arcadio mata a un hombre y tiene, en primer lugar, un terrible remordimiento, un terrible cargo de conciencia, que es el que lo obliga a abandonar su pueblo, a cruzar las montañas y a fundar el mítico Macondo.

Gabriel García Márquez: Sí. Él se fue y fundó un pueblo, y lo que yo más recuerdo de mi abuelo es que siempre me decía: «Tú no sabes lo que pesa un muerto». Hay otra cosa que no olvido jamás, que creo que tiene mucho que ver conmigo como escritor, y es una noche que me llevó al circo y vimos un dromedario; al regreso, cuando llegamos a casa, abrió un diccionario y me dijo: «Este es el dromedario y el elefante, esta es la diferencia entre el dromedario y el camello»; en fin, me dio una clase de zoología. De esa manera yo me acostumbré a usar el diccionario.


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